Since I first posted about Pagan podcasters Deò and Mandy, and their transition to atheism, a remarkably vibrant and thoughtful discussion has emerged in the comments section (Nearing 100 comments!). I urge you to take a moment and check it out if you haven’t already. However, my blog is hardly the only one exploring this topic and the issues it raises, here are just some of the posts from some fellow Pagan bloggers, authors, and pundits.

From MetaPagan: Spirituality, Identity and Community (by Yvonne Aburrow).

But is a religious label really about beliefs, or about participating in community, and sharing values and practices? Is it about doing something for the wider community? Or about a quest to understand the world and know how to live in it well? When does identifying with a label become membership in the group? Where and how does membership end? If you were accused of practising your religion in a court of law, would there be enough evidence to convict you? Perhaps religion is really a convincing narrative that helps to confer meaning on the world and our place in it. Even if it isn’t literally true, it’s symbolically true and internally consistent.

From The North West Passage: The Passing of Deo’s Shadow (by Brendan Myers)

I have to admit this affected me greatly, and not just because I was a guest on the show four times. Deo is a friend and a fellow philosopher. Before I moved to Hamilton, I was living only 20 kilometers away from him. He is also a remarkably generous, friendly, fun and kind person. I was dearly glad of someone in the community who has the same background and knowledge in philosophy as I do, with whom I can talk about such things. His departure from the community, therefore, hit me hard. His reasons for leaving it were sound and rational. It made me wonder if I have given much of my adult life to a community that doesn’t care about philosophers, and if I, too, have become merely a spokesperson for a tradition that is ultimately a dead end.

From Letter From Hardscrabble Creek: Pagans are not a Community nor a Tribe — Not Yet (by Chas Clifton)

What we have is a network, not a community nor a tribe. Maybe in a few generations that will change, who knows? (For you anthro and sociology majors, it is the Gemeinschaft / Gesellschaft issue, no?) Everytime I hear someone going on about “the Pagan community,” I say to myself, “Not yet.” Not when you can walk in and walk out so easily.

From Cernunnos’ Path: On the Threshold Between One Life Path and Another (by Mahud)

I have no idea where my path will lead (who knows, perhaps back to Christianity. I’m open minded enough to consider that a valid possibility), but I’m going to take it slow and not rush into this ritual or that magical practice or suddenly start worshipping a pantheon of Deities, just to fit in with the wide world of Paganism. Whether I stay or go, I’ll always have a piece of the Pagan community with me. But the way things are going now, I’ll be sticking around for some time yet.

From Chrysalis: Where Can We Grow From Here? (by Pax)

Well, it seems to me that the Pagan community could really stand to do a lot of work and soul searching on issues of Pride and Community.  I say this as a Pagan and Gay man who has often seen parallels and contrasts between his two subcultural communities. Why do we seem to have so much trouble coming together across lines of faith or Tradition to build community on the local, regional, and national levels?

And that seems to only be the beginning, I’m sure there are even more posts I’m missing out on. If you have commented on the transition to atheism by Deò and Mandy, or the issues it (and subsequent blog commentary) raises in your own blog/journal feel free to share a link in the comments (you can also consider this a “fresh” thread to discuss the topic if you feel a bit overwhelmed by the number of comments on the original post).

Deo’s Shadow, once the most popular Pagan podcast on the Internet, has decided to officially call it quits after several months of hiatus. In their farewell message, co-hosts Deò and Mandy describe how the podcast spurred them toward personal growth, specifically “growing out of” modern Paganism and into atheism.

Making deòs Shadow was usually a joy, and as the show grew more popular, we had many opportunities for new experiences which helped us to grow as people. One of the interesting side-effects of such growth is that one can end up growing out of that which induces the growth. We’ve moved on from Paganism and are now practicing atheists. We’re both in our 30s now, deò is half finished his PhD program (he began the show as an undergrad), Mandy is busy at a successful career, and we’ve got our eyes on the mundane things in life like securing a future and starting a family within the next few years.

In a follow-up post Deò ellaborates on his journey from Christianity, to Paganism, and into atheism (and why he isn’t jumping from Paganism into a different spiritual/religious practice). Spurring the follow-up was a comment by a listener of the podcast who experienced a similar (though not identical) trajectory.

I understand outgrowing things. I was a self proclaimed Pagan for 13 or so years. Recently after much study, therapy and self reflection I knew I had to take the plunge and drop the label. I can no longer label myself as a pagan. Doing this felt amazingly liberating. Who would have thought? Now this wasn’t necessarily a rejection of Paganism. I still find great value in many things deemed Pagan. This was just a moving forward from the need to put myself in a “box” that was stifling my growth. Now I know that this could be very offensive to some and I understand that.

Reading those pages made me think of the excellent posts by Cat Chapin-Bishop on her Quaker Pagan Reflections blog about balancing a Quaker and Pagan identity, about Al Billings’ (from In Pursuit of Mysteries) move from a Pagan/occult identity to Buddhism (albeit one still informed by his Pagan past), and even, briefly, about the conversion of author Carl McColman from Paganism to Catholicism. All of these narratives – Deò and Mandy’s, Cat’s, Andrea’s, Al’s, Carl’s – speak of growth, a growth that in most cases leads them away from a Pagan identity (or at least a displacement of Paganism as their core religious affiliation). Someone “outgrowing” Paganism (or hyphenating their Paganism) seems almost like a cliche nowadays, and it makes me wonder if we are alienating some of our more skeptical and philosophically-minded adherents in ways we don’t realize?

I say none of this because I resent Deò and Mandy’s (or anyone else’s) decisions, or that we should try to win them back. I wish them both the best, and thank them for their years of service to our communities. However,  that the hosts of a popular Pagan program have turned atheist should evoke some soul-searching about growth and maturity in our communities. Chas Clifton recently pointed out that pre-Christian (pagan) philosophy used to embrace everyone from the “hard” polytheists to the skeptical materialists. Who (and what) are we not embracing? Where are we not growing that these smart and talented folks must find their spiritual (or philosophical) satisfaction elsewhere? What do you think?

Their are three recent podcasts involving Pagan themes that I felt needed special attention. The first is from the Pagan talk program Deo’s Shadow*. In their latest podcast (posted July 16th) Deo along with co-host Mandy and special guest Kare (a Pagan parent and youth worker) discuss the issue of children and adult behavior at Pagan festivals.

[click here to download an Mp3 of the show]

Considering the recent conflicts over child endangerment (and accusations of pedophilia) within the Pagan community, I think this calm and adult conversation about behavior, who is responsible, and where we should set limits is refreshing. A must listen. Be sure to check out the spirited discussion of the latest episode on Deo’s web site.

Another show worth downloading and listening to is a recent episode of the wonderful religion radio program Speaking of Faith. In the June 28th show, host Krista Tippett interviews two experts on Haitian Vodou for a program entitled “Living Vodou”.

“The word “Vodou” evokes images of sorcery and sticking pins into dolls. In fact, it’s a living tradition wherever Haitians are found based on ancestral religions in Africa. We walk through this mysterious tradition – one with dramatic rituals of trances and dreaming and of belief in spirits, who speak through human beings, with both good and evil potential.”

You can download an Mp3 of the show, here. Be sure to also surf over to the page for the episode to download uncut interviews with the guests. Speaking of Faith is a very high-quality show and their episode on Paganism was very good, so this very much worth checking out.

Finally, Al from In Pursuit of Mysteries has posted the first of a three-part interview with Pagan author and teacher Thorn Coyle on his Ex Templo podcast.

“The fifth Ex Templo Podcast is now available. This is the first of the three parts of the interview with T. Thorn Coyle in San Francisco, California. In this podcast, Thorn’s spiritual background, her views on witchcraft and the Feri tradition and its practices.”

You can download an Mp3 of the show, here. Thorn is one of freshest thinkers within religious Witchcraft, and any chance to listen to what she has to say shouldn’t be passed up.

* You can also listen to Deo’s Shadow on the Pagan Radio Network, the best Pagan-themed streaming Internet radio station. PRN is also the home of my podcast A Darker Shade of Pagan.