United’s Pagan Problem

Jason Pitzl-Waters —  December 26, 2009 — 75 Comments

United, the airline that breaks guitars, is receiving some more bad publicity, this time from within the Pagan community. A Pagan boycott of the company is being suggested after they seriously bungled the aftermath of an altercation between a zealous Christian subcontractor and a wheelchair-using Pagan veteran.

“In August I filed a complaint against an employee of United Airlines who verbally attacked me for my religious beliefs. To date United Airlines and their subcontractor Airserve Corporation, have not made any efforts to alleviate the pain and humiliation I experienced. I had been traveling through Chicago on my way home to California when this incident occurred. I was waiting for a wheelchair to preboard my plane, but the attendant arrived too late to preboard me, despite the fact that I had asked him several times to ensure he returned for me on time. He then got another attendant who asked me to pray with him and give up my burdens to god. I am not a Christian and I informed him that I am the minister of a Druid congregation and then asked to change the topic. At this point he became confrontational and got down in my face; he began to quote scriptures at me and was so vehement that he sprayed spit in my face. He told me I would go to hell, quoted scriptures about false idols and told me that I would be a better person with his god in my life.”

After the humiliating incident, Rev. Jessie “Medb” Olson, Senior Druid for Feather River Grove, ADF, complained to United, and after some research, the subcontractor who employed the attendant. While Airserve Corporation (the subcontractor) did eventually fire the crusading individual, neither company has issued a formal apology for the incident, or refunded her ticket.

“…neither United nor the contractor, Airserve corp, has offered any restitution for the humiliation I experienced. United claims to have sent me a certificate for a new flight (no amount has been indicated) but I have NEVER received it and wouldn’t fly with them again if my life depended on it. All I want is my ticket refunded, a small price to pay for the horrendous treatment I received. I want to send a very clear message that United can not allow its employees to harass customers, no matter their religion, particularly helpless ones that can not remove themselves from the situation.”

Olson is calling for the Pagan community and its allies to boycott United and its subcontractors until this matter has been made right. I think the very least they can do is refund her ticket and issue a formal apology. Whether they do so remains to be seen, modern airline travel seems to be fraught with horrible customer service, and few step up and do the right thing without intense public pressure. You can contact United’s customer relations department, here, if you’d like to make your displeasure known. Perhaps the entire ADF and other large Pagan organizations can send a joint statement? I’ll keep you posted as things develop.

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Jason Pitzl-Waters

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  • http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100000225784000 Ed Hubbard

    This would not be the first time I have heard of United having very strong evangelical ties within it's staff. It's too bad, because the Vet said the right thing and asked that the subject be changed. It's really something to hear it from one of our vets.

  • http://www.wiakia.blogspot.com Susan Hurrell

    This is my email to United Airlines. Thanks, Jason, for bringing this to everyone’s attention.

    As a Pagan, I was deeply concerned to hear about the treatment of a US Veteran and Druid clergyperson, Rev. Jessie “Medb” Olson, who was aggresively evangelized by one of your staff while being assisted from one of your flights due to his disability – which left him physically unable to remove himself from this unprovoked act of fundamentalist terrorism.

    Your lack of response to his complaint is as unacceptable as the incident itself.

    I will boycott United Airlines and encourage others to do so, based on your tacit support for ignoring the rights of passengers in a religious minority and your lack of response to this “Freedom of Religion” issue that is supposed to be a cornerstone of American culture.

    I encourage you to make sufficient public apology to Rev. Jessie “Medb” Olson, and refund his full ticket price, and issue a public apology stating how you are going to train and uphold a standard of support for religous diversity amongst all United Airline employees.

    After all, our money has no religious affilition, and in these troubled economic times, you need customers. Customers can choose their air carrier – especially when you choose to discriminate against minorities by allowing them to be subjected to unwanted evangelical prosletization, and disregard of their legitimate human rights complaints that is a tacit endorsement of fundamentalist religious terrorism.

    I await your response.

    • Jennifer

      Pssst. Jessie is a her, not a him. Otherwise, great letter.

  • http://www.facebook.com/cara.schulz Cara Schulz

    The major airlines don't care and have had crap customer service for longer than I can remember. It's not that they don't care about PAGANS and so feel fine treating them like shit. It's that they don't care about their customers and feel fine treating them like shit.

    I fly very often – all across the USA. I fly just about every airline you can name. I usually receive better treatment when I fly the smaller, regional carriers than I do when I fly the major airlines and so I try to book with them every chance I get. I write letters to the small carriers telling them when they do something good, using names when I can. I point out when I spend more to fly with them, or note when i could have picked a different carrier and tell them the reasons why I spend my money with them. I point them to URLs when I write an informal good review of them and how awesome they are. And I usually get a response back. Likewise, when i have had a problem (pretty rare with them) I get a prompt response back.

    I have never, ever received a response back from a major carrier. Not when they have lost my luggage for weeks and refused to compensate me. Not when they have repeatedly overbooked flights and had to bump with NO compensation. Not when the bathroom on the plane didn't work. Not when I was seated next to a person that took up two seats (mine and theirs) and they made me lift up my arm rest so the person could be half on my seat and I had to put my butt up on the other arm rest and couldn't even use my seat belt.

    They don't care. Not United. Not Delta/NWA. Not American. Not any of the major carriers.

    • http://www.wiccanweb.ca Makarios

      You got that right. "Airline service" is an oxymoron. Whenever I have to do with airlines, I'm reminded of the old SNL skit, where Lily Tomlin, in her character of Ernestine the Operator, said:

      "So the next time you complain about your phone service, why don't you try using two Dixie cups with a string? We don't care. We don't have to. We're the Phone Company."

      Phone company, airline company, pretty much the same attitude. If you don't like our service, flap your arms and fly on your own.

      • Kantis

        Wow I agree the employee had no right to treat anyone in that fashion, religion or not. The fact that this person was fired makes me feel better about the airlines. I am not saying that United should not maybe offer more for the abuse. But, Yes, if Jessie wants to go forward with her requests. She should sue, it is up to her. We can't make that happen. I am glad that so many people want to jump and help. As a pagan myself as well as family that are military i am glad we have a community that stands behind us. Thank you

  • Jane Raeburn

    I was already boycotting them (after an incident in which my luggage wound up taking a trip to Seattle and I had to stay home) but will continue to do so.

  • http://byzantium.wordpress.com Kullervo

    Boycott United for what? Hiring a subcontractor who in turn hired an unpleasant Evangelical? Please. The subcontractor can't not hire someone for being an Evangelical, and United can't not hire the subcontractor for employing Evangelicals.

    For what then? For not doing enough to rectify the situation? Please, that's lame. They fired the guy. If Reverend "Medb" Olsen thinks United owes him something, he needs to get a lawyer and sue United. We have a system in place for rectifying injuries and making sure you get what you are owed. It's called "court."

    If United is somehow ultimately liable for the actions of this guy (and it's not an automatic thing; agency law in Illinois can get tricky with contractors and subcontractors), then they'll probably settle as soon as Olsen files suit. If not, then they aren't likely to do a lot to apologize, since admitting their fault may open them up to an easy lawsuit that they might not otherwise be vulnerable to.

    • http://hrafnspeil.blogspot.com/ Hrafn

      Seconded. It is amazing how many times I see people jump up and start talking boycotts when the situation is one that can be resolved in court, if the resolution on the table is not adequate.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/youngsoulrebel Ruadhan

      If Reverend "Medb" Olsen thinks United owes him something, he needs to get a lawyer and sue United.

      The article identifies the Reverend as a "her".

      • http://intensedebate.com/people/Erynn Erynn

        As usual, everyone assumes the veteran is male. This is a distinct problem.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/youngsoulrebel Ruadhan

          Yeah, I guess I missed the memo that all woman soldiers and veterans aren't "really" women. The United $tates has had women fighting in wars since Vietnam (maybe even Korea, but I know less about that one); woman veterans shouldn't be some brand-new-shiny-can't-understand-it concept to people.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Erynn Erynn

            Women have been fighting in wars since wars began. Maybe not officially, but we've had women vets from every war since the US revolution, some of whom were disguised as men. It's really annoying to be told I don't exist. *sigh*

            Women have served openly without having to disguise their gender since at least WW1 — https://library.uncg.edu/dp/wv/results167.aspx?i=…

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/youngsoulrebel Ruadhan

            Well, outside of US history, I've known of Keltic warrior women and that Spartan women were trained in hand-to-hand combat. I obviously stand corrected on women war veterans, but I also don't automatically assume that all female persons in menswear are "women disguised as men":
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transsexual_man

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Erynn Erynn

            Of course not. I did say "some". Being as I have a heaping pile of trans friends, I'm reasonably aware of the issue.

        • Ananta Androscoggin

          The first two places I ran across accounts of this incident the name was spelled "Jesse" — and every person I have so far met with that spelling (only two, admittedly) were guys.

          • http://www.druidmedb.com Jessie "Medb" Olson

            I don't really know about involving the media, I hope it doesn't have to go that far but will consider it if it becomes necessary.

    • http://twitter.com/thelettuceman @thelettuceman

      Its the lack of so much as an apology for the behavior of the hired employee that warrants action taken. It could just as easily be argued that the treatment of a handicapped veteran (which IS something a lot more pressing as they have to go out of their way for people with disabilities, by law) would be enough to be boycotted. Neither situation was warranted, and both were highly unprofessional in an industry that is hurting as much as the airlines are.

  • http://byzantium.wordpress.com Kullervo

    They haven't bungled anything. I don't know about the replacement ticket voucher; maybe they've been slow with that or maybe it got lost in the mail. It doesn't sound like they're really obligated to send it anyway, so it kind of sucks if they don't, but that's hardly bungling. Maybe they're morally obligated to make good without being sued, but the bottom line is that for a corporation, that kind of moral obligation does not operate in a vacuum. If they do the right thing, they can be vulnerable to peoples' opportunism. And the people who run a corporation have to think like that, because at the end of the day, they are doing business with other peoples' money, and the law is pretty clear about how you have to act when you are in charge of other peoples' money.

    If Olsen thinks United really and truly owes him something, the way for him to get what he is owed–and to determine if anything is indeed owed at all–is through a lawsuit.

    • Jane Raeburn

      I believe it is not OK for any customer, regardless of her religion, to be treated as this lady was treated, and will refuse to spend my money with a company that fails to acknowledge, TO THE CUSTOMER, that she was poorly treated and that steps have been taken to make sure no other customer is ever so treated. Whether or not they choose to back that up with a ticket voucher or other gift is up to them. It would certainly be the politic thing to do. But an apology costs the airline nothing and should be the least they can offer in the circumstances.

      • Hrafn

        I would say firing the guy is a pretty clear acknowledgement that his behavior was out-of-line. What steps do you recommend they take to keep an employee of a subcontractor from treating any other customer in such a way, ever? Sensitivity training?

        Depending on the local law, an apology could be perceived as an admission of guilt in a court of law, so an "apology letter" is not risk free until the lawyers clear it. It is pretty clear that they do not condone the behavior, however, and a boycott is likely be ineffective and is unwarranted.

        • Juliaki

          Nah, in this day and age, firing people is seen as an easier step to shut people up than saying I'm sorry. After all, saying I'm sorry might cost money or make your company seem weak…firing a person is just tossing out a meatsack that was costing money by existing anyhow. Let's face it, employees are a company's largest expense. If you can cut costs by cutting an employee, that helps your bottom line.

          Sensitivity training would be a PC way of saying they're addressing things. I'd personally like to see employers hold high standards for customer service. If you can't behave like a decent human being to other human beings, out the door you go.

  • http://Witchmoot.com James TwoSnakes Stovall

    Uh-oh, there is not some good old pagan “blame the victim” mentality creeping in is there?

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/BryonMorrigan BryonMorrigan

      I don't know about the motives of some of the people doing the "blame the victim" stuff here, but I have noticed that Conservative Pagans often like to side with the Christians in any discrimination issue because they are under the delusion that sucking up to them will make them seem less "fluffy."

      • Liz

        That, and they're under the delusion that Dominionism (and its attendant dangers) doesn't exist. Don't want to break the spell of denial by siding with people who've been treated horribly.

      • http://www.facebook.com/cara.schulz Cara Schulz

        What?!?

        That is an exceedingly crappy (and very untrue) thing to say. No matter what the topic, there is always some pointless, out of the blue shot taken at Conservative Pagans.

        Statements like this (and the wonderful +points showing agreement) are why, in many Pagan circles, people feel the need to still be in the (voting) closet about their political affiliation. It's OK to be ANYTHING in the Pagan community other than politically Conservative. And so many Pagans who are political Conservatives give up trying to be part of a community that shows hatred and derision towards them, not based on anything that they do, but just because they don't share the majorities political beliefs.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/GreenWaySkull GreenWaySkull

      I haven't noticed any "blame the victim' tone or mentality in any of the post. I have notices some people suggesting she should sue instead of or in addition to calling for a boycott. I also haven't noticed anyone siding with the evangelical employee only saying the employer couldn't not hire them due to religious beliefs.

  • Rombald

    Just to put my oar in. This is something I've been mulling over lately. Shouldn't we at least raise the issue as to whether pagans should fly at all??

    • Mona

      Why do you ask that question? I don't understand.

      • Rombald

        Because flying is about the most environmentally destructive thing an ordinary individual (i.e. someone on a more or less normal income, who is not a politician, a big-shot executive, or something) can do.

        • Mona

          I see. I thought you meant it some more esoteric meaning. I agree with you though.

          • Rombald

            I do think the environmental objection ties in with more esoteric objections – objections to hubris, to disregard for distance and place, ideas that one should know the land or sea one crosses, that sort of thing. If there's a slow-food movement, why not a slow-travel movement? However, the environmental objection is a start.

            I have built air-travel into my life, due to decisions I made decades ago (I can go into details if you like), and I am trying to see how to unravel things.

          • Mark Temporis

            Some people live on islands. What's the alternative there? From HI,. where I am, there isn't even any other way to go between islands, much less out of state.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/youngsoulrebel Ruadhan

            You do realise that he's just going to come back at this with "well, people inhabited Hawaii* for centuries before Big Bad Whitey came by with his aeroplanes! ZOMGZORZ LIVE IN HARMONY WITH THE LAND!"

            *"Hawaii" makes me wonder why Ameriklans are so dead-set on mispronouncing "kawaii" as "kuh-WHY". I know Japanese and Hawaiian are different, but they're closely-enough related languages that it reqally doesn't seem like much of a stretch.

          • Rombald

            Continued:
            I live in England, and, like a lot of people, I've got into the habit of flying to various parts of Europe several times a year. We tend to forget how recent this is – not before "big bad whitey" (which, in the context of England, would be, like, the end of the Ice Age!!!), but about 20 years ago. In looking for alternative modes of travel, I've been surprised how good they are – ferries to non-mass-tourist destinations are much cheaper than flights (eg. I plan to visit Denmark in spring, and the ferry is about half the cost of the plane, plus I get to watch seabirds with my binoculars, drink at the bar, and pose around on deck with my hair blowing in the wind!!).

          • Rombald

            Well, I'm not approaching this from the self-righteousness that Ruadhan seems to think I am. I did say that this is something I haven't sorted out yet – I have made numerous flights to Japan for business and family reasons, and I'm struggling to see what else to do.

            I don't know much about Hawaii. Are there really no ferries between the islands? Surprising, if true. It would obviously be difficult to travel quickly to the USA or Asia, although you could book a trip on a freighter if you had plenty of time (they're a lot cheaper than regular cruises).

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/youngsoulrebel Ruadhan

            Hawaii is the U$A — it may not be the continental U$A, but it is the U$A, nonetheless.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/youngsoulrebel Ruadhan

          Wow.

          Good thing not all "pagan" religions are the "Earth-based tree-hugging dirt-worshipper" variety you seem to think they are.

          • Rombald

            Ruadhan: I do realise that not all pagans are "Earth-based tree-hugging dirt-worshippers". I would be happy to use an alternative word if that would cause less offence.

            BTW: Japanese and Hawaiian are not related, not even remotely.

          • http://www.druidmedb.com Rev. Jessie Olson

            Folks, I do understand that the employee that harassed me worked for Airserv and that Airserv is a subcontractor of United AND the airport. However, the employee that refused to assist me when I asked for help, THREE times, WAS an employee of United and they are therefore still responsible for failing to assist a helpless customer when she ASKED for help. Not only did I ask for help, I specifically told the woman that I was receiving a lecture about God and needed someone to get him away from me.

            So, yes, United IS responsible and culpable in this incident.

          • Mark

            Not a UA employee= UA not at fault. Damn simple. There’s no real case here, if the facts are as presented. She claims 34 lawyers have agreed… So she either doesn’t get the pic, or this is attention-seeking behavior.

            I suggest a collection and offering a gift to the fired employee, to show love.

            Love is alwys a better message for pagans to broadcast then anger and outrage.

            Either way, there doesn’t seem to be a case here. Time will tell.

          • Fey Tree

            Wow, clearly you didn't read the post. She said that the 34 lawyers she's spoken with either didn't specialize in that area of law or don't want to deal with the small amount she's asking for.

            I know this woman personally, she agonized over even making it public for months before she finally decided to take matters into her own hands.

            She's a very level-headed person but very passionate about her beliefs and defending those who have been wronged. In this case she IS the one who was wronged and I applaud her for standing up for herself. Jessie is probably the most honest and ethical person I know.

            She wouldn't do anything for publicity or attention unless she felt it would bring some kind of attention to the injustice that has been done to her.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/BryonMorrigan BryonMorrigan

            Wow.

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/Nope Snoozepossum

            You're in a position to lick your own tonsils right now, aren't you?

          • http://quakerpagan.blogspot.com/ Cat C-B

            Judgmental much?

          • http://intensedebate.com/people/GreenWaySkull GreenWaySkull

            THe only way I can see the United employee being held to any culpibility is if you took the offending evangelical employee to trial for assult and won. Then you may be able to get her on some technicality like 'assisting' or some such. Other than that I'm not sure there is any way to get to her or United.
            I'm not defending her, what she did was morally repugnant and very sad, unfortunatly it wasn't really legally wrong (at least not in anyway I'm aware of and I did ask a criminal lawyer friend of mine).
            Best of wished to you in resolving this.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/BryonMorrigan BryonMorrigan

      The last time that I flew somewhere, I had a pretty awful experience. I did the math later, and found that it would have cost me less money, and taken less time, to just drive there. (And this was a Tampa-NYC flight…)

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/sari0009 KarenAScofield

      No. What you don’t do is inject another debate, as important as it may be, that seemingly negates, trumps, or usurps, making the discussion at hand regarding abuse/equality appear moot. It adds to the list of hurt and wrongs while not even giving your issue (to fly or not to fly) proper platform and participation.

      In America, mootness is a legal concept of "not actionable." Socially too.

      There is a time and a place for everything. If you want to honor both this discussion and yours, give your argument a proper platform. Usurping other highly charged debates isn’t that.

      • Liz

        This. Suggesting that the problem is that this woman shouldn't have been flying in the first place is some really obnoxious derailing.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/sari0009 KarenAScofield

          I feel **very** strongly that way, yes.

        • Mark

          I know lawyers… If there is a case, I’d expect at least one of them to have phoned a friend and got things rolling. We’ll see. I still agree with the others who have said that boycotting a firm that was only tangentially involved isn’t what’s best here.

      • Rombald

        Point taken. This is a discussion group, though, not a court of law.

        • http://intensedebate.com/people/sari0009 KarenAScofield

          You said:

          "This is a discussion group, though, not a court of law."

          The gist of my comment is that it can derail a discussion to inject another debate, as important as it may be, that seemingly negates, trumps, or usurps, making the discussion at hand regarding abuse/equality appear moot.

          Mootness, as a legal concept, was only mentioned in passing the way it was in order to illustrate that the described tactic can be derailing across the board, indicating **a very strong human behavioral pattern or tendency,** which underlines just how wrong the tactic (of injecting another debate the way you did) is.

  • A.C. Aldag

    Two points that aren't being addressed:

    What is United, and other airlines, doing to prevent this from happening again? Are they educating employees about persons with disabilities? There are going to be more and more of them flying, as the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan render more service members disabled. Rudeness and ignorance aside, it was terribly negligent for the airline to fail to get a wheelchair for this passenger and to delay her primary boarding, so that she had to stand longer and suffer discomfort and pain. Especially to someone who has served in our Armed Forces, those who are fighting to make our air travel safe! United needs to educate its employees and subcontractors in the proper way to handle passengers with physical handicaps.

    What is United doing to ensure that some religious wing-nut is not forcing his or her brand of insanity onto passengers? Would a Jewish passenger be treated this way? A Muslim imam? I think not.

  • http://www.druidmedb.com Jessie "Medb" Olson

    Just for the record, I HAVE contacted several lawyers (34 now) and each tells me that, since all I'm asking for is a refund of my tickets and not damages, they can't help me. Additionally, most of the lawyers I've talked to specialize in employment discrimination issues or civil rights for inmates, so none of them knew what to do about my case except to refer me somewhere else.

    All I've requested so far is a formal apology from Airserve and United. In addition, I would like my airfare refunded. I don't believe that I'm asking for much here, this isn't an issue with luggage or a rude flight attendant, it was an act of vehement hate and prejudice while I was restrained and I think that the least they could do is apologize and refund my tickets.

    Thank you all for your support. I've been a Pagan for over eighteen years and this sort of thing has never happened to me before, it really came as quite a shock.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/sari0009 KarenAScofield

      I'm so sorry that happened to you. I suffered abuse in the name of God so I know what it feels like.

      However, making it an issue of a refund is will mostly likely continue to sink the whole thing.

      You'll most likely get much farther if you seek to treat it as an abused while restrained issue that happened to have creedist abuse elements added to it. When I was confined to a room by my (now ex and deceased) husband and beaten in the name of God, it wasnt' really about God — it was about him getting to abuse me.

      Which is exactly what that employee did to you. That employee took opportunity. She took advantage that you were chemically restrained and in a wheelchair at that time.

      I would suggest a lawyer that specializes in the rights of the handicapped. Oddly, going that route may win more attention and compassion to the religious rights elements of your case. I would not be surprised!

    • http://www.walkofthefallen.com Labrys

      Jessi, may I suggest, since you ARE a veteran, that you contact the Military Religious Freedom Foundation? Sometimes their legal team is able to move mountains—-and since a religious assault like this IS the very thing that makes Mike Weinstein's blood run hot, it surely cannot hurt. The website does have ways to contact them for help—and they LOVE to publish stories like yours: http://militaryreligiousfreedom.org/

    • trouble

      I'm sorry – I posted to you without hitting the "reply" button. You probably are updated when someone "replies" to you. Please read my post and let me know if there is anything that I can do

  • Ananta Androscoggin

    I haven't flown anywhere since eight days before 9-11. Partly it's because the airlines don't tend to treat their passengers much better than they do the baggage. Partly because so-called "airport security" is mostly a propagandic fraud, a public façade to fool the flying public into thinking that it is safe to fly.

    In my own case, our household does not spend money at any location of JC Penny, as I'm still awaiting an apology for the four squad cars in Saco, Maine. I figure they don't need my money all that badly. The large nationwide corporations are screwing our country over almost as badly as the multinationals are doing.

  • http://www.druidmedb.com Jessie "Medb" Olson

    The ACLU said their lawyers would call me back (this was in September), I have called every Wednesday since and continue to get the message that there is no one to take my call. I have contacted my local ACLU, the ACLU in Chicago, and the ACLU in Northern CA as well as several legal referral services.

    I have also contacted several lawyers (34 now) and each tells me that, since all I'm asking for is a refund of my tickets and not damages (though maybe I should be), they can't help me. Additionally, most of the lawyers I've talked to specialize in employment discrimination issues or civil rights for inmates, so not one of them knew what to do about my case except to refer me somewhere else.

    I am getting somewhere though, as a result of this letter being circulated I was told to file a charge of discrimination under the Illinois Human Rights Act. I will be doing so tomorrow morning and I'm certain that the intake interviewer will be able to tell me if my complaint qualifies. Thank you Dana D. Eilers for the suggestion.

    I really just want to call their attention to this issue. United (who employed the flight attendant who refused to help me, I asked three times and told her what was happening), Airserve (the offending party's employer), Chicago O'Hare International Airport (who hired Airserve as their subcontractor), the City of Chicago (who owns and operates the airport), and the employee himself should all be made aware that this is not acceptable and I hope that the experience will somehow improve sensitivity training in the future.

    I've been a Pagan for over eighteen years now and I just don't know what to think about this whole thing. Nothing remotely like this has ever happened to me. I've always been open about my beliefs in every aspect of my life and I've never been the target of such overt hatred, prejudice, or bigotry before. It was a real shock for me. For those of you who have faced it before, I am sorry. There is no reason for this sort of thing to happen in our world today, but it does. All we can do when it does is draw attention to it and increase awareness so that it will happen less often in the future.

    Thank you all for your support, it is much appreciated.

  • http://www.facebook.com/amberapple Peg Aloi

    When an overzealous Christian tries to shove their religion down your throat, all you can do is firmly stick up for yourself and either ignore them or explain to them why their belief system is not of interest to you.

    This incident is unfortunate, and certainly does sound like harassment, but beyond the employee being fired for behaving inappropriately, what more satisfaction can be hoped to be gained from this? The airline could offer a voucher, but a refund is probably not going to happen. Monetary remuneration will probably only happen as a result of a lawsuit. A public apology, as has been pointed out, would be an admission of discrimination; the company did not discriminate, the employee did.

    I think the end result of this is that there are some really unpleasant people in the world who think they can use their jobs and professional positions to advance their own agendas. This is never appropriate, and such behavior should be punished. And, in this instance, it has been. Other than learning from the experience, and perhaps raise awareness about the inappropriateness of such behavior, I'm not sure what more can happen here.

    If I tried to lodge a formal complaint every time some Xian fundie got in my face in a public place, I'd have very little time to do anything else.

    • http://intensedebate.com/people/Erynn Erynn

      I suspect that under normal circumstances you would be able to get up and walk away. It's very different if you're drugged to the gills and stuck in a wheelchair with no options.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/al_billings1727 Al Billings

    As has been pointed out elsewhere, the subcontractor in question is subcontracted by the AIRPORT, not United. United uses the subcontractor that the airport provides. This has nothing to do with United really. Complain to the airport.

    • http://threedogcircus.blogspot.com Grainne

      Thanks, Al, for mentioning this. In most cases, the airline doesn't get to choose which contract service is used to assist customers with special needs. That's done by the local airport authority.

      BTW, I work for United, and I'm also a Pagan so the whole "let's boycott United for being discriminatory" thing rings a bit hollow. I know I'm not the only Pagan here, either.

  • http://www.pagansunited.org Laura Roberts

    There is always the media. I'm sure that say humm CNN would love a story like this, a disabled vet and Pagan. I think perhaps I'll post on my Ireporter column and see what happens.

    Unfortunately, unless you take them to court you will probablty never see the refund on your ticket. I'm sure they feel that discharging the employee should have been enough.
    Perhaps a media power point on the different Pagan Paths could be sent to the Heads of these airlines in hopes of better educating their staff and employees.

    Laura Roberts
    Pagans United
    Member ADF

  • Mark

    After speaking with an attorney friend of mine (she’s gay, a senior partner in a large firm, and has handled many discrimination cases):
    she reminded that all comments on these blogs would be discoverable in court — even those on “private” boards such as ADF’s. Just FYI, in case in goes that route.

    She also agreed that there didn’t appear to be any wrongdoing by UA here, other than slow customer service.

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/BryonMorrigan BryonMorrigan

    Exactly. It's a really disturbing trend and ought to be fought with ridicule and condescension.

  • Balzaimon

    You cant reason with most christians, its against their religion.

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  • http://www.hecatedemetersdatter.blogspot.com Hecate

    What a horrible experience! Flying is such a miserable experience these days, even for those of us who don't require a wheelchair. ( I fear this weekend's events are only going to make that worse.) I can't imagine being subjected to this experience while wheelchair bound and worried about making a flight. I'm going to write to United.

    BTW, I'm a lawyer. Suing is one way to resolve a dispute. It's not the only way. Asking like-minded people to write letters and/or to boycott is another way.

  • Finnchuill

    I already boycott United having had horrific experiences with them myself. I'm sorry to hear Jessie, a highly respected clergy, was subjected to such harassment. I'm shocked that some are supporting the airline's behavior.

  • Juliaki

    I must admit, I'm a little queasy about the idea that someone of any religion needs to be prayed for because they're in a wheelchair.To me, that sounds like an ADA issue to be brought up, because the implication is that someone in a wheelchair is some how "defective" and needs to be "fixed."

  • http://intensedebate.com/people/sari0009 KarenAScofield

    Wow. Technically, not being able to walk due to a combination of muscle relaxant medication and physical challenge creates what is sometimes referred to as a chemical restraint. It's called abuse if that's taken advantage of in any wrong way. If I did that to a patient or nursing home resident, I could be in a world of trouble, and I'm not talking about the kind that only involves refunds, apologies, and/or getting fired.

    The airline employee abused Rev. Jessie “Medb” Olson while she was chemically restrained. That takes the abuse to a whole other level, obviously.

    It's incidents like these that help underline the differences between orthodoxy (correct faith) and orthopraxy (correct practices, including but not limited to ethics, functional virtues, hospitality, and equality). One can easily "judge" even the best of people in a dehumanizing abusive denigrating manner over some faith-based clash.

    It's much more difficult to loose sight of treating others ethically and with mutual courtesy and respect if your power metaparadigm (mother world view or reality filter) is that of equality, pluralism.

  • Mona

    You make an excellent point here. That wa clearly abuse launced in Rev. Olson's face. I am a public school teacher. If I were to abuse a wheelchair-bound child, or any child, in that manner, I would lose my job and be sued. I believe United and the company that hired that fool are counting on Rev. Olson's good heart not to take this matter any further. I certainly would pursue legal action.

  • trouble

    I am so sorry to hear of your troubles! Have you tried to contact your local ( or any chapter – perhaps the one near where this took place ) of the American Civil Liberties Union? Or maybe a veterans rights organization? Maybe even a military chaplain could help – they're "supposed" to be available to help with wiccan rituals for the enlisted – maybe one of them could help to at least point you in the direction of added support from a veteran standpoint? I realize that you've probably tried all of these things, but it is all that I can think of at the moment. My hopes and wishes go your way, and with your permission (of course!), I will anoint a candle just for you. I commend you for only asking for an apology and a refund, and not becoming bitter over this – it only shows how truly good your character is. Blessed Be!